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Monday, July 28, 2014

LBGT at Sandia

LGBT intolerance problem at Sandia?

I was just checking glassdoor.com and noticed several comments suggesting intolerance to LGBT at Sandia. Is it really that bad there? Can anyone else provide any more info on what is going wrong there? Is it some sort of toxic bleed-over from Lockheed?
July 26, 2014 at 4:39 AM
 Delete
Anonymous Anonymous said...
An certain senior manager in Security & Reliability at Sandia National Laboratories Livermore (you can use Google to find his identity) made several disapproving comments about the LGBT lifestyle to his staff when he was (and still is) a manager. These comments are well known to his staff, and he should be fired for making these comments to his staff.
July 26, 2014 at 5:11 PM
 Delete
Anonymous Anonymous said...
Some of the glass door comments are scathing. Too bad for Sandia that they are true. They use workplace bullying and discriminatory practices to protect their own. Sandia is the worst of the three labs when it comes to issues regarding minorities and LGBT.
July 26, 2014 at 5:57 PM
 Delete
Anonymous Anonymous said...
I can confirm the 2nd post on July 26, 2014 at 5:11 PM.

The individual referenced used to be a manager in Org. 8200. A better Google search is: "Security & Reliability" at Sandia National Laboratories Livermore linkedin (don't forget to use quotation marks)

I can also confirm the disparaging comments he publicly made to staff that expressed his disapproval of those in the LGBT community.

84 comments:

Anonymous said...

Employees are obliged only to follow law and employment policies. They are not told what to think. That comes from within. PC hoopla is insufficient moral guidance. Hits shows many instances, Taters, wahabis, national socialists where political correctness violates individual morality.

Follow what you hold to be true, and adjust your employed behavior to whatever the current rules and laws are to protect your income. You owe no one anything more.

Anonymous said...

Who do you think you are, John Galt?

Anonymous said...

2:42 PM sounds like one of those Sandians. Abuse minorities and LGBT so long as they can get away with it. I guess there is no point in them pretending that they are a good organization with a strong and modern organizational culture.

Anonymous said...

So let me get this, You want everyone to except a sexual perversion and those that do not you would have them to disappear. People it is a sexual perversion which needs to treated. What's next horses, dogs, sheep, snakes. FIne country!!!

POS

Anonymous said...

July 29, 2014 at 2:42 PM


Wow, that was an utterly trivial point. Do you have anything of actual depth to add?

Anonymous said...

"So let me get this, You want everyone to except a sexual perversion and those that do not you would have them to disappear. People it is a sexual perversion which needs to treated. What's next horses, dogs, sheep, snakes. FIne country!!!

POS

July 29, 2014 at 6:17 PM"

I am not sure what you mean by sexual perversion and I doubt you any real idea sure either. One can always say that Christianity is a dangerous mental illness that needs to be treated. We are only free when everyone is free.

"But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.

-Thomas Jefferson, Notes on Virginia, 1782"

Anonymous said...

And wonder what our founding hypocrit thinks about that now...

Anonymous said...

hell hath no fury..

Anonymous said...

in this, i kinda agree with the ol' slavedriver, (slavebanger?). my beliefs don't bother you ol' buggers at all.

so follow employment laws and policies while employed to protect your income and think rather what is inspired in you,

for you are not obligated to be PC, only to appear to be so.

This is how faith survived under despotic rule from the beginning of time.

of course we will struggle for the mind of youth, or in your case,the bottoms of catamites...(the modern day Janissary)

Anonymous said...

"Wow, that was an utterly trivial point. Do you have anything of actual depth to add?"

Study the gift and you will change. The object is your soul, not your comfort.

Anonymous said...

"We are only free when everyone is free."

Free from what? From death? From toil? From intercourse? From gravity? From ugliness? From suffering? From disorder? From hate? From fear? From scarcity? From uncertainty?

What meaningful freedom can you attain on your own, human?

Anonymous said...

The Truth will set you free.

I am the Way, the Truth and the Light, he who believes in Me will never die..

So there it is, take comfort and sleep well cause this revelation is for all, every one of us, no matter our particular peculiarities

Anonymous said...

While we are at it, we should take the science out of the lab and replace it with scripture based methods. Continuum mechanics and nuclear physics are all just theories anyways, and scripture has theory deserving of equal consideration.

Anonymous said...

To every thing, there is a purpose and a time for every season..

Anonymous said...

There is reason to observe what one can and to learn from observation.
There is reason to learn what others have learned.

There is a logical desire for better, for these sources alone are observed to be changeable,limited and incomplete.

Anonymous said...

God forbid that we ever get into the topic of inter-racial dating, or desegregation. Self-described POS is sure to have some harsh words for such abominable ideas.

Anonymous said...

This is NOTHING compared to what happens at NIF on a daily basis.

Anonymous said...

"The Truth will set you free.

I am the Way, the Truth and the Light, he who believes in Me will never die..

So there it is, take comfort and sleep well cause this revelation is for all, every one of us, no matter our particular peculiarities

July 29, 2014 at 9:08 PM"

So every other religion in the world is wrong.

Look you are free to believe what you want and they are free to believe what they want.

Anonymous said...

What exactly were the disparaging remarks made by the person from SNL?

It is not uncommon for people to disparage the lifestyle activities of other adults - adultery, polygamy, incest, prostitution, sexual fetishes (e.g., B&D).

Maybe these comments shouldn't be made - but they are. I move on with my life.

Ironically, it is PC to ridicule some groups (e.g., men, Christians), but not others.

Anonymous said...

Sandia should stop advertising its inclusiveness if they aren't an inclusive organization. It's fine if they are not. They can join the chickfilets and Fox News like organizations of the world. It's not doing applicants any favor to lie about the actual workplace environment. It is the cause for the conflicts and disparagement. It is false advertising.

Anonymous said...

It's not that they dislike diversity. They just protect the people who create a toxic and antagonistic work environment, while at the same time, retaliating against those victimized by the workplace bullying. In effect, it's institutionalized intolerance. They like the words "diversity and inclusiveness" in their corporate values but their implementation shows their real views.

Anonymous said...

Can anybody explain how the Manhattan project was successful without an LBGT policy?

Anonymous said...

Lip service?

From the SNL website...
----------
"Committed to diversity and inclusion, we can ensure that Sandia attracts, retains, and develops a world-class workforce."
- Paul Hommert, President & Laboratories Director

Diversity and inclusion are defining elements of Sandia. They foster multiple perspectives, promote acceptance of different learning and working styles, and encourage the innovation for which we are known. Diversity, by definition, is any mixture of people, groups, or ideas not limited by gender, age, culture, sexual orientation, or physical or intellectual abilities. Inclusion is the practice with which we value those differences and commonalities and leverage our diversity for exceptional service in the national interest.

Committed to diversity and inclusion, we can ensure that Sandia attracts, retains, and develops a world-class workforce. One of our core values at Sandia is to work together for great results. We share this common vision by fostering an attitude of mutual respect. Inclusion is a conscious choice. It is Sandia’s choice.
----------

Anonymous said...

Can anybody explain how the Manhattan project was successful without an LBGT policy?

white men

Anonymous said...

"Can anybody explain how the Manhattan project was successful without an LBGT policy?

July 30, 2014 at 3:14 PM"

Well the Manhattan project was incredibly PC for it's time. They had people from all over the world including a very large contingent of people from a Jewish background. It was a true lessen in how diversity works. I would also bet there where plenty of folks from LGBT where part of the Manhattan project as well.

In any case we know of only a few but there must have been may more. One example Alan Turning.
If you doubt his contributions to the war effort than read below.

"At the now famed Bletchley Park in Buckinghamshire, England, Turing directed his faculties to code breaking. He was the mastermind behind the Turing Bombe, an electronic device designed to ascertain the continually changing settings of Germany's Enigma encryption machines. They could decrypt secret messages discovered, revealing critical military secrets.

"The scientific triumph at Bletchley - secret for the duration of the war and for 30 years after - had a greater effect on the outcome than even the Manhattan Project, the real bomb," wrote James Gleick in his 2011 book "The Information." "By the war's end, the Turing Bombes were deciphering thousands of military intercepts every day: processing information, that is, on a scale never before seen."


Anonymous said...

The issue is not about LGBT policy but rather about the kind of hateful abusive environment in an organization that warrants a specific policy (whether LGBT or minorities or disabled or senior citizens or whatever). Policy for the sake of policy is silly. It's there because there are closet racists and homophobes in most organizations who will make it their point to engage in workplace bullying and other abusive tactics to make themselves feel better or self-righteous.

Anonymous said...

So the career prospects of a professed bigot are pretty good there? And the bigot is in senior management? Doesn't surprise me one bit.

Anonymous said...

I would also bet there where plenty of folks from LGBT where part of the Manhattan project as well.

This kind of pandering speculation is just embarrassing and pathetic.

In 10 years this guy's story will evolve to that Oppenheimer was LBGT because consensus says so.

Anonymous said...

Back in the days of yore, gays hid in the closet and inter-racial dating was taboo. In those days, it was completely appropriate to go blackface in entertainment, and make slanty eye humor in polite company. Not sure how you can have policies to protect people who were not targeted for abuse since they were hiding in the woodwork. I'm sure people who were tagged as gay (even slightly effeminate or different straight men) were either subject to abuse or sent to electroshock therapy. On top of that, it was completely appropriate to engage in workplace bullying and abuse for whatever reason.

Wasn't it only until Clinton that they started changing the rules on being gay and getting a security clearance? It's clear some of you are still living in the dark ages, grasping onto your old hateful ways.

Anonymous said...

So, if I filter down your diatribe, you believe that more progress is made when people stay in the closet, eg. Manhattan project vs. today.

Anonymous said...

it wasn't a diatribe, nor was it a connection between gays and progress. its a statement of civility and proper motivation (i.e., doing your job, instead of creating toxic bigoted environments) and progress.

Anonymous said...

there are some very recent studies strongly correlating latent bigotry with obama-hate. very interesting, though not surprising at all.

Anonymous said...

"This kind of pandering speculation is just embarrassing and pathetic."

It could also be called statistics.

Anonymous said...

Not discriminating against any group of people is good security practice. You remove the possibility of blackmailing someone and therefore inherently improve security.

So even if you are against someone because of your personal beliefs, from a security standpoint it is plain dumb to discriminate.

Anonymous said...

So, if I filter down your diatribe, you believe that more progress is made when people stay in the closet, eg. Manhattan project vs. today.


No. The explanation is that there were few or no bigots on the manhattan projects. The best of the best scientists, trained to evaluate ideas based on merit, are less likely to inject any potential prejudices and personal biases they may have against any group. A bigot starts with a conclusion (I.e., gays are bad) and makes decisions to try to justify the conclusion (treated dismissively, exposed to abuse to adversely impact their work and performance, etc.). Get only smart productive and non-bigoted people and you have a better chance at progress over groups where discrimination and workplace bullying runs rampant.

Anonymous said...

LLNS has minority employee bias too. Some LLNS minorities have succeeded on the backs of the more vocal minorities, and suffer from a form of accomplishment amnesia.

Anonymous said...

"...Get only smart productive and non-bigoted people and you have a better chance at progress over groups where discrimination and workplace bullying runs rampant.."

I agree with you. Except bigots don't usually wear "I'm a bigot" T-Shirt to job interviews. Once embedded within the organization and their conduct ignored, bias becomes part of the accepted culture.

The more pro "diversity" proclamations this type of organization makes, the higher the red flag goes up for me.

A rough analogy is seeing large banners at used car company X stating "all our salesman receive training on the importance of trustworthiness", but are otherwise free to do business as they wish. Something worth knowing up front.

Anonymous said...

It could also be called statistics.

Then site them, otherwise it's just optimistic speculation.

Also, are we now saying that bigots can't add anything to progress?

Bill Schockley, and he wore an I'm a bigot shirt along with all the early 20th century eugenics crowd.

Anonymous said...

If people act on their personal biases, it's pretty obvious to those being affected. People are not stupid. Bigotry is pretty easy to spot. The offenders, on the other hand, most often think their subtle acts of discrimination are not being noticed.

Anonymous said...

August 1, 2014 at 9:17 AM

Thats a very good point. One should be suspicious about such open proclamations of values. They are often only aspirational values (perhaps by some but not all) when in fact their managers and employees behave quite differently. I think some pointed out quite clearly, how certain weapons labs have institutionalized bigotry and discrimination.

Anonymous said...

You guys should invite Al Sharpton to LLNL to help weed out all these bigots. He's the man at sniffing these things out... tawana brawley, Duke Lacrosse.. etc.

This seems to be life topic number one on your minds so you guys are now known as the Phillip Drummonds. Google it.

Anonymous said...

You don't need Al Sharpton to weed out bigots at Sandia. Some have been already pointed out.

Anonymous said...

could you please specify the type of bigots? race, gender, orientation, creed ...etc.

It's important I know what type of bigot then I can tailor my outrage appropriately.

Anonymous said...

"It's important I know what type of bigot then I can tailor my outrage appropriately.

August 1, 2014 at 7:22 PM"

Nanos hated scientist class.

Anonymous said...

You say NIF is bad but was it a toxic environment created by bigotry or because there were strong personalities, competing agendas, poor leadership, etc?

Anonymous said...

Many managers with official diversity related functions voiced concerns of direct and observed bigotry and bias up to the point of their own advancement, but not past it.

They will argue from their "new vantage point", there are "other ways" to address these issues. "Other ways" meaning pretend the issues don't exist using themselves as an example, and "new vantage point" meaning they are being highly compensated for taking such a position.

Only second to the actual bias and bigotry itself, are those with programmatic "diversity" functions that betray our trust to preserve and expand their own monetary gain.

Anonymous said...

Hey August 2, 2014 at 6:29 AM,

What is your point?
Give either facts or philosophy. Don't just ramble.

Anonymous said...

"...What is your point? Give either facts or philosophy. Don't just ramble..."

What is my point? Really?

Strategically placed minorities are the first line of defense to combat workplace discrimination complaints and are often the point of contact for federal agencies that formally address such matters. This is how the game is played.

If you interpret this as meaningless ramble,
you are either a guardian of the status quo, an inexperienced new hire, or a diversity manager.

Anonymous said...

Another red flag along the lines of excessive diversity proclamations is the apparent need to send LLNS minority X employees on recruiting and outreach efforts to colleges with a dominant population of minority X students. How does this benefit the graduates and prospective employees?

Is our "equal opportunity" record so fragile as to require a LLNS employee in the same minority group to vouch for the lab in these venues?

Anonymous said...

August 2, 2014 at 7:56 AM


I assume you hold the same opinion regarding women's promotional directive at the lab.

Anonymous said...

For whatever reason, Sandia thinks that protecting and shielding "problem employees and managers" when they express their bigotry and general bad behavior, tells you one clear message... if you are the target of workplace abuse, you should expect a double whammy from HR and management. They would rather have victims leave, than to take corrective action on offenders.

For highly qualified applicants considering employment at Sandia, you are better off (both compensation wise and in terms of strong corporate culture) at other highly regarded companies that do not have Jim Crow like policies.

Anonymous said...

"...I assume you hold the same opinion regarding women's promotional directive at the lab..."

My comment was specifically on LLNS minority recruiting methods. Am I to assume you believe LLNS women managers should be the exclusive recruiters of women? This would relate directly to my comment.

Anonymous said...

"...women's promotional directive at the lab..."

There have been multiple women and minority promotional events and directives over the years with mixed results . Poor follow through is usually the issue.

Anonymous said...

Boy, from reading this blog, you'd think all national labs care about is getting numbers up for women and minorities.

I don't know what to think about all this passive aggressive talk and sarcasm regarding this subject.

Anonymous said...

Funny you say that. Yes, they care about a number, but no, they are not interested in creating a highly performing organization free of bigotry its resulting toxicity.

Anonymous said...

"...Boy, from reading this blog, you'd think all national labs care about is getting numbers up for women and minorities..."

The "numbers" or utilization tables, will be paraded around as a defense to any workplace bigotry or bias claim by an individual.

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Anonymous said...

August 4, 2014 at 5:07 AM


That's because women and minorities are more immune from bias and prejudice.

Anonymous said...

"...That's because women and minorities are more immune from bias and prejudice..."

Would you expand on your point please?

Anonymous said...

That's because women and minorities are more immune from having bias and prejudicial thoughts.

Anonymous said...

"...That's because women and minorities are more immune from having bias and prejudicial thoughts..."

The "utilization tables" are a metric by which employment opportunities for women and minorities are evaluated to address historic and present day prejudicial actions (not thoughts).

The only "immune" minorities I am aware of are some (not all) with embedded programmatic diversity functions. The rest of the minorities can be vulnerable to bigotry and bias, and I believe that was the point made in the "parading around" of the utilization tables comment in the early post.

To your point, yes the diversity pendulum can swing too far in some circumstances. When the observed "immunity" is not addressed, it undermines the broader equal opportunity effort.

Anonymous said...

Please see LLNS "diversity" related August 6, 2014 at 3:23 PM comment under "Status".

Anonymous said...

"...I assume you hold the same opinion regarding women's promotional directive at the lab..."

After reviewing the 2011 OFCCP NORI LLNS violation described in the "status" post, perhaps a "heart to heart" discussion with your purported "womens promotional directive" sponsors is in order. As has long been the case, everyone is not rowing in the same direction for women or minority advancement at LLNS.

Anonymous said...

This blog is funny...

It says that we can combat bigotry with a biased promotion of minorities and women.


Anonymous said...

That's funny.

Notice how August 7, 2014 at 10:33 PM accurately sums up the argument for minority and woman promotion, and how silly the argument actually is.

But this is the way of the world. Steer clear of meritocracy, for you may not like the results.

Anonymous said...

"...Notice how August 7, 2014 at 10:33 PM accurately sums up the argument for minority and woman promotion, and how silly the argument actually is..."

There is no "accuracy" in his summation, anymore than that echoed in an earlier time. Honestly, if you are a male, would you want your wife, sister, or daughter's prosperity subject to a "majority rules" male dominated workplace?

Anonymous said...

Yes, of course.

That would mean my wife is working in Silicon Valley at the forefront of technology deployment, with stock options working in as close to a meritocracy as one can get -which in fact she is.

Anonymous said...

"...Yes, of course.

That would mean my wife is working in Silicon Valley at the forefront of technology deployment, with stock options working in as close to a meritocracy as one can get -which in fact she is..."

Sure and her workplace success and that of her female friends have solely been based on their talent and free of workplace obstruction to growth. Great news! That means we are making good progress from my old man perspective.

It must be cool to have been born in 1985 or so.

Anonymous said...

Speaking of spouses, why doesn't anybody complain about all the "power couples" at LLNL.

You know, those couples who's combined income is pushing or exceeding $500k. This is really questionable "practice" and should be addressed openly.

Anonymous said...

What's questionable about it? What difference would it make if they were working in different places and making $500k.

Anonymous said...

"....What's questionable about it? What difference would it make if they were working in different places and making $500k..."

Because if they were working in different places one could not politically leverage LLNS career opportunities for their spouse over more qualified candidates thats why.

http://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/Employee-Review-Sandia-RVW4576331.htm said...

This is the post from the original glassdoor.com review:

http://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/Employee-Review-Sandia-RVW4576331.htm

“The most LGBT unfriendly employer I have ever seen, with institutionalized workplace bullying. ”


Former Employee - Principal Member of the Technical Staff in Albuquerque, NM
Pros
Do you like it when the place of your employment is completely deserted right at 5pm? Sandia is the place for you. Great for work/life balance if that's what you are looking for.
Cons
I had been there for several years, and had been the target of workplace bullying during the last year. When I reported it to management, they whitewashed it and then subsequently knocked my performance appraisal down. Here is an organization that cares more about how you fit in terms of the individual power agendas, and less to none about how performance impacts the enduser customers. They institutionalize bullying by telling people (me included) to not escalate such things up the normal path (i.e., through management, and in writing). That was all I needed to know to make my decision to leave. LGBT? Don't bother. They are very LGBT unfriendly.

Anonymous said...

Actually, the most LBGT unfriendly employer is the Taliban.

Anonymous said...

"...Actually, the most LBGT unfriendly employer is the Taliban..."

What is your point here? A National Laboratory need not worry about bullying, bias, or discrimination because they are worse outside of the USA?

If you get caught for bigotry or bias at the labs I wouldn't base your defense strategy on a planetary discrimination grading curve.

Anonymous said...

I think the Taliban comment was for humor.

If the LBGT issue is a top priority for the National Labs, then the end is near.

Which is more sinful? LBGT bigotry or racial bigotry or gender bigotry? If racial bigotry, then which race deserves the most protection, or do all races deserve equal protection? Or is all bigotry equally evil, and as such, each sub group deserves equal protection, and only white males deserve none. Please explain.

Anonymous said...

You do know that according to some studies affirmative action has disproportionately benefited white women more than any other protected group.

Anonymous said...

Does open opposition to bigotry and bias mean you will be chronically subject to abuse and retaliation at LLNS?
See "status" 8-16-14 9:56am comment.

Anonymous said...

You do know that according to some studies affirmative action has disproportionately benefited white women more than any other protected group.


I don't need studies, I can just see the results at the lab.

Anonymous said...

Understood

Anonymous said...

You do know that according to some studies affirmative action has disproportionately benefited white women more than any other protected group


Are you saying that some groups can excel beyond other groups given the same rules?

Anonymous said...

"...Are you saying that some groups can excel beyond other groups given the same rules?..."

No it just pays to "have an uncle in the business".

Anonymous said...

named "Tom" I suppose.

Anonymous said...

For white women "Uncle" meaning:

Uncle, father, brother, husband, cousin, etc. already employed here being white and dominant in the workplace. A factor to consider before stating as an absolute some groups" "excel" implying others can not.

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