"I signed up for vssop on 2/14 and my transition ID number was lower than 250, so that number is not accurate for a total count."
That's great. Maybe we can get that number down to less than 100 or so. After all, you gain nothing by going now and are not sure you'll even get unemployment, so why not wait until they fire you and then you'll get it for sure. That would at least give you time to find a job during our current recession. By not taking the VSSOP will force management into doing a ISP by at least June of 2008. This will hold LLNS accountable, and make them hand pick the 650 people they need to accomplish their mission of tossing 750 out the door by Mid March.
From what I have heard the list has been compiled since December of 2007. Regardless, I'm sure LLNS will be more than accommodating on short order, but you at least would not have quit your job only to make their job easier.
The latest rumor is that LLNS already knows they're $50M short for FY-09. So what's that spell? " VSSOP / ISP / RIF" ?
Are we having fun yet?
But lets get this straight:
There is a VSSOP (Voluntary Self-Select Option Plan) and an ISP (Involuntary Separation Plan). There isn't a ISSOP (Involuntary Self-Select Option Plan?) nor a IVSSOP (In Voluntary Self-Select Option Plan?) nor a IVSP (In Voluntary Separation Plan?) ( There is a difference )
15 comments:
Unless you really, really just can't stand it at LLNL I'd be staying. That however is your choice and your call but do think it over very well just don't miss that seven days they give you or you won't have a choice, you'll be gone and LLNS will be very happy.
There is a difference between VSSOP and ISSOP. If you just get RIFed, you wont get the continuing medical benefits for 2 years like you would in VSSOP.
Oh I see you get one year of COBRA paid in full by LLNS, the second year you pay 50% and they pay 50% and on the third year you pay 100%. Yep I see the benfits of not geting unemployement here. I guess it's a matter of choice as it was in the TCP-1 and TCP-2 misinformation drama. SOSDD.
Do I need medical or will I gamble that I can do without for a short time in order to get unemployement for 52 weeks. Let me think. I'll get back with you in a week or two. I check with my wife that has beneifts already.
Yeah, how many will actually qualify for that medical plan anyway? You can't get it if your spouse works, if you get another job, if you retire, or if you're old enough for Medicare. If your spouse doesn't work (or you're single) and you're not old enough to retire, I'm thinking you'll be needing a new job real quick. Oh, yeah, that's a real great benefit they're offering there!
First, let's get this straight: there is a VSSOP (Voluntary Self-Select Option Plan) and an ISP (Involuntary Separation Plan). There isn't a ISSOP (Involuntary Self-Select Option Plan?) nor a IVSSOP (In Voluntary Self-Select Option Plan?) nor a IVSP (In Voluntary Separation Plan?) OK?
There are differences between the VSSOP and the ISP, but the medical in not the main thing. The biggest thing is notice, which they must give you by contract if you are laid off (ISP). (You do realize if you take the VSSOP, you're resigning.) Also, you retain rehire rights if they lay you off (ISP), and give up those rights if you go VSSOP. Finally, your right to unemployment insurance payments seem much more clear if you're laid off (ISP).
The problem is, LLNS won't say there will be an ISP. Why should they? They've created enough fear, uncertainty, and doubt with this VSSOP that some will feel forced to take it, and it is definitely LLNS cheapest way to get rid of career indefinites. That's why they won't release any more info than they have. They want us to be scared, real scared. Easier to control folks that way.
Most everyone I've talked to believes an ISP will be coming, but how much are you willing to gamble? What if they pull a LANS and say the VSSOP was enough? What if they hold and ISP and don't choose you to let go?
The one and only redeeming value of the VSSOP, if you can call it that, is that you get to pull the cord. And, as the first respondent says, if you really, really can't stand LLNL and especially what LLNS has turned it into, if you hate driving through the gate every day and want to get far away as fast as you can, if you've got a line on another job where they just might actually value their workforce instead of mouthing the words, then maybe the VSSOP is the way to go.
One foot in the rowboat with 93 hours to decide if I'm all in.
"Most everyone I've talked to believes an ISP will be coming, but how much are you willing to gamble?"
An ISP is coming and I'll tell you why I say that. I just got off the EBA list by taking a job. It's a job that's below my skill level and by all means one that's substandard to everything I have done over my career building years at LLNL. I was reluctant to take it so I call my old boss and told him what was offered. I was told ,"take the job regardless of the skill". "You don't want to be on the EBA list come next month". Enough said.
With that said I understood that something is going to happen to all of those who are on the EBA list next month. I think they'll just be gone on a moments notice. They'd had adequate time to find jobs and the party is over.
February 15, 2008 2:40 PM
Very good input and with that I still think I'll wait to get fired, get the severance pay, then the unemployment and move on. At least I didn't resign and make their job easier. ULM is the ones who are getting the big bucks to make people's lives miserable so I say send the thugs to bed with best wished from all whom they've demoralized, angered and victimize. I hope they live forever with this on their conscience, if they have one. I'm not sure the borg have evolved that far along.
Oh and don't forget on every important issue everyone seems to be over looking. If you are eligible to retire you must do so within 90 days or you'll lose you retirement medical too. So don't miss this boat or you'll be SOL for life.
Get laid off, get the pay, retire and call it good is the route for a few who are in once sense lucky.
Careful there. I can only speak to TCP2 and UCRP, but it's actually 120 days, not 90. (I'd guess it's probably the same for TCP1, but they haven't published anything yet. Should be the same. Substantially equivalent, don't ya' know.)
One benefit of LLNS/NNSA ineptitude on the VSSOP is the fact that the separation date was moved from the end of FEB to MAR 14. For UCRP inactives (not currently double dipping), this means that the 120 days extends until JUL 12. A 2% COLA is applied to the HAPC on JUL 1. Kind of like a raise you never got. Also, if you retire on JUL 1, you'll be eligible or the pension (monthly) COLA in 2009, rather than having to wait another year. Whoopee!
" A 2% COLA is applied to the HAPC on JUL 1. Kind of like a raise you never got. Also, if you retire on JUL 1, you'll be eligible or the pension (monthly) COLA in 2009"
Don't believe so ... On Jul 1, you are either Inactive (2% cola added to HPAC), or Retired (2% cola added to monthly annuity).
Can't have both (Inactive AND Retired) on same day.
Read it again. If you retire on JUL 1, 2008, you'll get the bump in your HAPC. Then on JUL 1, 2009 you'll get the COLA for your monthly. If you wait until JUL 2, 2008 or later, you won't receive the first pension COLA until JUL 1, 2010. Never said you'd get both at the same time on JUL 1, 2008.
I was told ,"take the job regardless of the skill". "You don't want to be on the EBA list come next month".
I would like to add to that that there are several former EBA employees that were shoved into jobs, regardless of qualifications, even in "leadership" positions! Just so that they get off EBA status. That is wrong! This illustrates the chaos created by the transition and the 3161 plan. This practice also robs those internal qualified candidates that are really interested in the openings.
This is a waste because an EBA that was placed in a non-fitting job will sooner or later quit, wasting everyone's time.
Strategic Human Capital Management, aka HR, aka Personnel have a case of cranial inversion!
There clearly is pressure to get people off the EBA list. The major matrix organizations have essentially spent their entire FY08 EBA budgets already, with no end in sight.
On the other hand, being on the EBA list is not necessarily the kiss of death. Especially for everyone but the 200s, the personnel policies still call out seniority. If you check your LLNS job offer, nowhere did it use the term "at will" (unlike the offer at LANL). As was said in another post, the policies for an involuntary layoff of FTEs are not clear, and ULM is in a bind.
"As was said in another post, the policies for an involuntary layoff of FTEs are not clear, and ULM is in a bind."
February 18, 2008 6:46 PM
I guess when you get the director off his butt to clearly define what a "unit" is you'll know if your gone or not. Until then just stay jumpy and worry about what smack lipping jerk is stabbing you in the back to make sure they look better than you so they can have your job. My question is. Is what LLNL has turned into worth staying for ?
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