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Sunday, February 16, 2014

CIP question

What does everyone think of the CIP at LLNL?

47 comments:

Anonymous said...

Most people would get more of a raise from having the pension liability recalculated and scaling back the employee contribution.

Anonymous said...

Is there any evidence that a liability recalculation would have that result??

Anonymous said...

Interest rates trending up = current value of future liabilities trending down.

Anonymous said...

Management views our cip as an source of income.

Anonymous said...

Insulting. The process costs more than most will receive. Why bother? My insurance cost went up more than I can possibly receive. Another year of negative take home.

Anonymous said...

Interest rates trending up = current value of future liabilities trending down.

February 16, 2014 at 10:40 PM

Wrong. Liabilities remain the same, although percentage funding of the plan may increase. Liabilities are solely dependent on demographics and actuarial analysis.

Anonymous said...

Stop studying the cip & hand it out.

Anonymous said...

There is nothing to "hand out." They are studying whether they can afford to take the money from the current operating budget. That is how salary increases work. DOE/NNSA approves but provides no additional funds. I guess the choice boils down to no raise vs laying more people off in order to afford giving a raise to those left. I'd consider that a tough choice.

Anonymous said...

It's not an either or (pay raise or layoff). Raises have always come out of operating funds.

There was no problem in handing out the last operating fund budget surplus.

Anonymous said...

Of course they can afford it, and yes it comes out of operating fund. The same place the management fee & bonuses come from.

Where else would you think it comes from? The cafeteria tip jar?

LLNS itself submitted the CIP, and its not a large one by any means. Save money by cutting overhead expenses.

Anonymous said...

Of course they can afford it, and yes it comes out of operating fund. The same place the management fee & bonuses come from.

February 17, 2014 at 12:50 PM

Nope. Management fee comes after NNSA ratings and is earned separately from the operating budget. It is illegal to mix the two.

---
There was no problem in handing out the last operating fund budget surplus.

February 17, 2014 at 12:41 PM

Obviously there is no "surplus" if people are getting rif'ed.

Anonymous said...

No one gets fired over the cip that LLNS submitted.

Worth repeating. LNLS submitted the cip they could afford - it was not forced upon them.

No sense getting stingy over about a nominal pay raise, because they'd rather spend overhead dollars someplace else (and spend them they will - regardless of rifs).

Notice that the root word in management, "manage"!

In the future, why doesn't LLNS stop submitting cip packages for their employees?

Anonymous said...

Good point.

Submit the only cip you can afford, or none.

That way you can also cut the costs of putting one together and its execution.

Anonymous said...

Next FY don't submit a cip & avoid the drama.

How are all the other DOE science & national labs handling their raise packages?

Anonymous said...

Fire Moses, and divide one year of his salary among the survivors as a one-time bonus?

Anonymous said...

Prediction: Nothing will happen with the CIP until after Oct. 1. The talk about "LNLS submitted the cip they could afford - it was not forced upon them" is just talk. Times change, circumstances change, management changes it's mind. A gift promised is not a gift received. This whole issue probably seems like pretty small potatoes to those who lived under Knapp at LANL. Be thankful he hasn't revealed his dark side much yet. If he is chosen as the next Director, watch out.

Anonymous said...

>"Worth repeating. LNLS submitted the cip they could afford - it was not forced upon them."

Wrong. LLNL submitted a CIP request that was larger than what DOE/NSA granted.

Anonymous said...

The cip was not forced upon LLNS. Seems like a true statement to me.

Some would have us believe that pay raises are absurd, and that they come out of operating fund is cause for alarm.

Pay raises are a normal cost of doing business, and yes they do come out of operating funds.

Cut overhead spending for savings.

Anonymous said...

Give me my nickel or I will sue for 100 zillion dollars because I am a lab loser.

POS

Anonymous said...

LLNS doesn't have to give out raises, but then don't submit a cip. Save both the raise money and the management costs associated with the bid & its various committees & components.

Of course LLNS will have to explain to DOE why all the other science and national lab employees received them.

My opinion, replenishing a fund that was emptied by discretionary spending with the employees pay raise is bad form.

Anonymous said...

Leave. and retire.

50 people at WhatsApp created $17B in value for Facebook.

When the young folks leave in droves, CIPs get larger.

Or go in to your division leaders office and rationally express your displeasure. 180 visits will get her attention.

Anonymous said...

"50 people at WhatsApp created $17B in value for Facebook"

Kind of unbelievable, except that WhatsApp has over 450 million users outside of the US and Facebook is freaked out.

Maybe we can convince Facebook that Google is interested in Fusion Energy, and they better get on board !

Anonymous said...

By my math, Facebook could recoup its investment in under 4 years, if they charge each user $10 per year. Currently the first year of WhatsApp is free, the second year $1. I wonder if Facebook can get away with it, since all trends point to younger teens ditching Facebook in droves.

Anonymous said...

By my math, worker level miniscule pay raises, won't make or break the lab. It'd be refreshing if was handed out.

Anonymous said...

If you are the type to be refreshed by an insulting single drop when you are dying of thirst.

Anonymous said...

Take the drop, there will never be a thirst quencher from this LLC.

Anonymous said...

Take the drop, there will never be a thirst quencher from this LLC.

February 23, 2014 at 10:08 AM

Seems to me the only reasonable thing to do is look for a better water source.

Anonymous said...

Or get a new spigot manager, there seems to be plenty of water above.

Anonymous said...

You'd think these new management people invented and own the water.

Anonymous said...

Not invented, but they DO own it. Time you realized that, and paid them what they require for you to get it. Or go away.

Anonymous said...

Actually they don't. They've been hired to manage it. That explains the source of their arrogance.

In the long run, they will have made a lot of trouble for the real owners.

And yes they'll be the ones to go away. Workers stay, management companies come & go.

Anonymous said...

Actually they don't. They've only been hired to manage it. You've explained the source of their arrogance.

In the long run, they will have made a lot of trouble for the real owners.

And yes they'll be the ones to go away. Workers stay, management companies come & go.

Anonymous said...

Please learn how to stop double posting.

Anonymous said...

And yes they'll be the ones to go away. Workers stay, management companies come & go.

February 24, 2014 at 6:25 AM

From the comment at February 22, 2014 at 1:03 PM, under the Wednesday, February 19, 2014 top post:

"When the money dries up and the long knives come out, the "problems" are the first to go - so if people want to be "problems", fine, but they need to be willing and prepared to bail out."

I couldn't have said it better myself. The discussion was about some people on this blog apparently believing they are bullet-proof, like you.

Anonymous said...

So because some worker bees want their <1% pay raise, they should quit or be fired?

Nice work environment. There are better ways of avoiding cip distributions.

Anonymous said...

Nice work environment. There are better ways of avoiding cip distributions.

February 24, 2014 at 2:55 PM

There are MUCH better ways of being satisfied and happy with your career. Most of them don't involve working for people you despise.

Anonymous said...

"I couldn't have said it better myself. The discussion was about some people on this blog apparently believing they are bullet-proof, like you.

February 24, 2014 at 9:40 AM"

You really seem to misunderstand the posts. The labs are just the workforce and the most talented have either left, could leave if they like, or are close of enough to retirement that it does not matter. That is the catch about talent you have to treat it well or lose it. Yes the best are bulletproof. The results of this can already be seen as some of the best have left and the labs are no longer even close to the same level they once where. The management has learned the hard way the talent is not replaceable.

The workers are not the "problems", the workers where never the "problem". The workers are the lab, that management not so much. Get rid of the workers and you have only management and you have no lab. You have to be a fool not to think those outside the US have been watching this. There will be real consequences.

Anonymous said...

February 24, 2014 at 7:21 PM said... There are MUCH better ways of being satisfied and happy with your career. Most of them don't involve working for people you despise.

Nicely put. You can usually put up with high-level people you never interact with - after all, the Democrats survived Bush, and the Republicans will survive Obama. But when there is a systemic problem with management reaching down to your immediate supervisors and colleagues and making you miserable on a daily basis, it might be time to rethink why you work where you work.

Anonymous said...

Part of the negative reaction to the Bechtel management group, is that the LLC never took the time to build positive employee relations.

Most people are getting out, but excuse them if they don't sing high praise for a company that has never given them the time of day.

Anonymous said...

You obviously missed the little fact that the managing partner of LLNS, and the Chairman of the Board, and the President of LLNS, are UC people, not Bechtel.

Anonymous said...

Employee treatment is still the same.

Anonymous said...

Perhaps, but I guess it doesn't bother you that you are blaming the wrong people.

Anonymous said...

Bechtel has nothing to do with anything negative. They told me so.

Anonymous said...

I know no one owes anyone anything & we are all lucky to have jobs, but there are better ways of executing a cip.

Anonymous said...

...there are better ways of executing a cip.

February 26, 2014 at 7:10 PM

Yep - bullet through the brain.

Anonymous said...

"Yep - bullet through the brain.

February 26, 2014 at 9:07 PM"

Go for it.

Anonymous said...

Already done, CIP will not happen.

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