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Friday, January 17, 2014

Strike?

Any details on the LLNL Union protect that happened Wednesday afternoon at the West Gate? I heard the employees who were picketing were handing out informational flyers on their demands, but I didn't get one. If someone did, could you summarize. Is an actual strike looming?

106 comments:

Anonymous said...

If the craftworkers strike that might be a good thing all around to get rid of the babies.
Have you dealt with the infants lately?
I am sorry to say I look forward to the day the Laboratory outsources this function.
Unfortunately the NLRB is very liberal now and I do not think any company can win a case there.

It was sad to see (at the West Gate) how ungrateful people can be for this valuable employment we have. I think it hard to describe how the babies looked.

Anonymous said...

First the crafts people, next the engineers. Why do you think that most of the Labs engineering can't be done in China or India ? We already hire a lot of foreign post docs. And the Chinese and Indians are better educated, actually read journals, and can build stuff. Do you know an Lab engineers that can weld and machine. Only guys/gals that work on race cars.

Anonymous said...

Do you know an Lab engineers that can weld and machine.

January 17, 2014 at 11:33 PM

Why would a highly educated engineer want to do a low-wage, blue collar job? Show me a welder or machinist who can design a data acquisition system for a physics experiment.

S said...

There is no threat of a strike.

There is simply an expectation/demand that the equipment needed to run this lab be well maintained and that the managers not neglect this maintenance in order to save money as they increase their bonuses by pointing to this "cost saving".

Some may consider this expectation as harmful and even frivolous but when buildings and equipment start falling apart the obvious next step is to shut the building down and move the work to some other site.

If you want to embrace that possibility/likelihood then feel free to encourage our managers to let our buildings and equipment deteriorate as you complain about the people who have kept lots of this equipment running well past the manufactures estimated life span.

Anonymous said...

If you wish they would out source, I say be careful what you wish for. They out sourced our building (132S) and when the boiler took a dump, we were freezing for close to two weeks, and in the end, Plant came in to fix it because the outside company couldn't. I appreciate the plant people,and the job they do.

Anonymous said...

I do not appreciate the plant people.

The sooner the Lab outsources,
the better.

Anonymous said...

As I understand it, many of you custodians feel that way.

Anonymous said...

And so do many Managers.

It is time to outsource.

Anonymous said...

Do you know an[y] Lab engineers that can weld and machine.

Absolutely. I know a lab engineer who first made his living as a welder.

Anonymous said...

Seeing the demonstration was very strange.
Seeing these poor victims makes me think of why our great country is in so much trouble.
It is because people with little education (like these) are easily swayed and can be led easily by corrupt union leadership.

Maybe if they learned critical thinking (like in higher education)they could see how they look, I am actually embarrassed for them.

The poor little union victims.

Anonymous said...

Our union members look educated compared to the BART union.

Anonymous said...

I think we should ease up a little on the union workers. How did our "critical thinking" via our "higher education" help us detect and prevent falling for bait and switch tactics and false promises from LLNS before the take over? Perhaps too many college level "critical thinking" courses are subject to grade inflation.

Anonymous said...

How did our "critical thinking" via our "higher education" help us detect and prevent falling for bait and switch tactics and false promises from LLNS before the take over?

January 19, 2014 at 4:37 PM

"Critical thinking" is very valuable in life, but will never be able to detect intent to deceive with lies about future actions. If anything, a typical liberal college and graduate education these days suppresses the natural urge to doubt and mistrust others. Today's kids grow up with their innate "bullshit detectors" having been deactivated by the indoctrination process we now call "higher education."

Anonymous said...

So, a few more snarky comments about engineers. Just want to remind you that we can---and do---escape. Most of the rest of you are stuck. Jealous?

It really feels good not to no longer be at LLNL.

Anonymous said...

Oops! Strike "not".

Anonymous said...

The so called "uneducated":

"...It is because people with little education (like these) are easily swayed and can be led easily by corrupt union leadership..."

The so called educated":

"..."Critical thinking" is very valuable in life, but will never be able to detect intent to deceive with lies about future actions..."

With this logic, only the "uneducated" are expected to see the future and know how and where they are being led. Hmmm. Sounds like either group can be misled, so we shouldn't look down our nose at our coworkers.

Anonymous said...

The trades, techs, engineers, scientists and professional support staff all have their role and value.

There. Was that so hard?

This has nothing to do with proper maintenance of equipment so that its failure is averted and the consequence of failure avoided.

Anonymous said...

3-d printers are coming in and replacing anyone in manufacturing, fabrication and craftwork. Next will be protective services who will be replaced by rent-a-cop contractors.

Anonymous said...

My neighbor who does not work at the lab happened to drive by and see those people. Over the weekend she asked me why homeless people were gathered in front of the lab wearing orange shirts. When I told her that they were lab employees she thought I was joking around. Then I told her that they belonged to a union and she finally believed me.

Anonymous said...

"The trades, techs, engineers, scientists and professional support staff all have their role and value."

Of course they are valuable but you can have much better value with a non-union contractor.
The every day headaches (on an operational level) of dealing with an uneducated union steward or high school drop out union head takes away from productivity at any business.

It is a no brainer that "anything" that has to do with a union is not productive for any company.

Just ask Apple.
They built their new factory in a Right to Work state.

Anonymous said...

3-d printers are coming in and replacing anyone in manufacturing, fabrication and craftwork. Next will be protective services who will be replaced by rent-a-cop contractors.

January 20, 2014 at 6:07 AM

Don't hold your breath. Unless by "manufacturing, fabrication and craftwork" you mean stuff made out of plastic.

Anonymous said...

Just ask Apple.
They built their new factory in a Right to Work state.

January 20, 2014 at 9:03 AM

Also Boeing.

Anonymous said...

Goodbye middle class! The 1 percent are taking over and we just stand around watching....
At least they (the union) are smart enough to fight back.

Anonymous said...

These guys dropped out of Tracy High or Modesto High in 1976 (admittedly, actually graduating from those places doesn't make much of a difference over the drop out). They saw the unskilled jobs that were available to them were mechanic, firefighter, food preparation worker, cop, retail, etc. They also saw that they could get a unionized overpaid blue collar job scamming the public dollars at PG&E, Caltrans, or LLNL. Some chose LLNL and today still have their haircut from 1976. In addition to their haircut from 1976, their world view has not changed one bit since that time. They still believe the USA and the world in 2014 are the same as in 1976. They are delusional.

Anonymous said...

You obviously do not know these guys.They are NOT the dropout losers you keep talking about.They have skills that not everyone can do.They are educated and very high skilled. I really am sick of you degrading them.

Anonymous said...

Yes but a non-union craftsworker can do the job without the baby stuff!!!

I think everyone here agrees that a union atmosphere is the most unproductive entity in our society......
oh sorry I have to go for my union-mandated 45 minute break....I'll be back (LOL)

Anonymous said...

Sometimes when Daddy and or Momma pays for the kids college degree, appreciation for the working class is lost.

Anonymous said...

You know that is BS. The lab has not been about the worker since 2007, hence the name of this blog.

Anonymous said...

3:51 @ 3:40

Anonymous said...

"Sometimes when Daddy and or Momma pays for the kids college degree, appreciation for the working class is lost. "

94% of the working class are NON-union.
I respect the working class, greatly.

What I DIS-respect are unions, < 6%.
The most unproductive entity there is.
in other words there is NOTHING productive about a union parasite.

Anonymous said...

oh break time again.

Anonymous said...

Some of our current non-union benefits were forged by union efforts. Again, easy now on the put downs.

Anonymous said...

Some of our current non-union benefits were forged by union efforts.

January 20, 2014 at 6:33 PM

Historically accurate, but irrelevant to the discussion. Done is done.

Anonymous said...

Yes but unions have morphed.
I personally was all for unions back in the day.

Now the unions are different and have evolved.

I would not be part of a union for a million dollars.
Only weak minded followers would join a union.
Sorry treading as lightly as possible because unions are pretty messed up. It is sad. the original people who sacrificed for our unions would be ashamed at these Democratic voting organizations.
It is sad and you are a weak minded, lazy human being to belong to a modern union.
I know it is hard but try to think autonomously (that means try to think for yourself you poor drone) and try to see what a modern union stands for,
I know it is hard being a high school drop out but you poor union victim try to use your brain...try I know it is hard but try to think for yourself. Try!

Anonymous said...

January 20, 2014 at 9:07 PM:

To whom was your comment directed? January 20, 2014 at 7:31 PM was not a pro-union comment.

Anonymous said...

For those who are too lazy or too hateful or too mighty or too overly educated and needing to feel superior, or any of the other reasons that you can't understand why the union was formed prior to the lab being outsourced to a for profit entity.

The flier said:
----------------
Who we are, and why we are picketing today

We are Lawrence Livermore National Lab’s maintenance workers—full--‐time employees of Lawrence Livermore National Security, LLC

We are skilled craftspeople whose job it is to keep the Laboratory running safely and efficiently. We are now negotiating our next contract with management.

We are journeyman air conditioning mechanics, locksmiths, boiler mechanics, carpenters, electricians, heavy equipment mechanics, laborers, maintenance mechanics, painters, plumber/pipefitters, riggers, sheet metal workers, trades helpers, and welders.

We routinely work around hazards that our counterparts elsewhere never or rarely face: radioactivity, biohazards, high explosives, and contamination from beryllium, lead, depleted uranium, asbestos and heavy metals.

Since LLNL privatized in 2007, we have seen our ranks drop by approximately 50% as the newly--‐formed company LLNS attempted to impress DOE and win $ millions in management incentives by cutting, among other things, the maintenance budget, deliberately allowing the Lab’s infrastructure to fall into disrepair. Management’s new motto was ”Run to Fail, then Maintain”

This misguided policy has led directly to several safety incidents and many more close calls. Accidents and faulty equipment affect all Lab employees and could also endanger the surrounding community.

“Running to fail” makes no business sense either; repairs are more expensive and more disruptive to Lab operations than preventive maintenance to equipment and facilities.

We are dedicated and responsible employees who take pride in being part of the history and heritage of the Laboratory. Without us, the Lab could not function. We see the Lab’s accomplishments as ours too.

In recent years we have seen our wages lag behind prevailing wages in our crafts. We want our new contract to close this gap.

We also want an end to the relentless push to do more with less. We have deep pride of ownership of the equipment and facilities that we maintain. Management sometimes exploits that pride to get things done “on a shoestring”. As a result, some of us are overworked.

We want a fair contract and to do our part in restoring the Lab to greatness.
--------------

FWIW These are not the uneducated folks that some of you think they are they are simply the people who decided that their aptitude was more geared to the skilled trades than the higher education think makes you superior.

Anonymous said...

This proves the above points.
The poor victim in the above posting, will like any union try to suck the life out of any company.

We all can agree that a non-union contractor can do the same job without all the baby stuff like the baby in chief at "January 21, 2014 at 3:06 PM".

If you read it the above post says everything about the infants.

Let's outsource and soon.

Anonymous said...

I don't see any "victim" in there.
I see some reasonable concerns that all folks at the labs should be concerned about.

Anonymous said...

So a non-union employees...contractors are not a better fit for the Lab?

We have 7000 non-union (known as merit employees because you are payed on your merit not the same as a lazy union protected employee) workers and I would say the skill level of those 7000 merit employees is pretty good.
I would go on further that 94% of employees in California are merit based.
So the white elephant in the room is,
why does a union bring to the table?

The answer is nothing but problems.

Ask Apple who is building their factory in Arizona for only one reason......NO UNION PROBLEMS, PERIOD. There is no other reason.

Anonymous said...

There is a reason that private sector unions account for less than 6% of the private workforce. No workers who actually want to work and get ahead see a need for a union which will take their dues money involuntarily and use it for purposes with which the workers don't agree. All the worker protections that unions historically worked for are now law. No further need to have stupid politics controlling your career future.

Anonymous said...

Many of you don't appear to understand that the deminished standing of the middle-class coinsides with the demise of the unions that you deslike with such passion.
I'm certainly OK with your willingness to further diminish the middle-class' standing (Heck I've already got mine too) but you should at least try to understand how your desires will negatively impact those behind us.
Then again with a whole political party dedicated to the demise of the middle-class it's no wonder that so many embrace those desires.

Anonymous said...

Then again with a whole political party dedicated to the demise of the middle-class it's no wonder that so many embrace those desires.

January 21, 2014 at 8:06 PM

Your political underpants hanging out just destroyed your seeming attempt at logic. Poor you.

Anonymous said...

I hire the guys in the Home Depot parking lot to do the jobs described in 3:02 PM posting above. They don't speak English and have a fourth-grade education and do the job well.

Anonymous said...

That apple factory is to build those "made in America" tubular desktops? That product is going to flop anyways. Those jobs are good as gone. Should have been outsourced to Taiwan/china anyways, to let them be more competitive with pcs.

Anonymous said...

"Your political underpants hanging out just destroyed your seeming attempt at logic. Poor you."

I'd claim that your hate for unions, and the people they represent, has destroyed your attempt at logic too but I haven't seen a whole lot of logic behind the hate.

It's interesting that some allow the Home Depot parking lot folks to work on their giant home equipment.

Anonymous said...

Oh now we are haters because we have a negative view of unions.

I might say your political underpants are hanging again....Liberal.

For those of us who do not understand the Liberal union playbook it is like the above post.

In other words when you run out of arguments (because your ideology does not correspond with reality) then call the other side haters :)

I think the union babies lost when they were being "the poor, poor victims" and having a temper tantrum at the West Gate.

Honestly it was hard to watch the drones.

Anonymous said...

Yes, it is no longer possible to have a rational discussion with most liberals. They run out of facts and coherent argument quickly and resort to derogatory labels and name calling. The challenge for the rest of us is to not sink to that level in response. The idea that anyone who disagrees with them is a "hater" is particularly difficult to stomach, but since it has no real effect on anything except one's emotions, one can learn to ignore it.

Anonymous said...

Too much infighting here. Instead of projecting distain for the union folks, perhaps we "the professionals" should at least learn if the framework for fair and balanced employee and employer negotiation is present. Why? Because the absence or state of such a framework is the "canary in the coal mine" for non-union LLNS workers too. Except for protected managers, we are ALL "at will" employees. I don't think most LLNS employees understand or fully appreciate how fragile and unstable our benefits and employment really are now.

Anonymous said...

Is there a better term for the desire to outsource the jobs that our skilled trade's folks do than "hate"?

Is there a justification for the desire that we fail at everything beyond the term "hate"?

Is there a better term than "hate" for the dubiously educated and the obviously un-educated’ desire that everyone behind them live a diminished lifestyle than they were afforded simply because they believe that it should be an every man and women for themselves from here on out?

Help me out here because I'm not sure what that term would be.

Anonymous said...

In your nice wisdom (and I mean that) the point that a union crafts worker at the lab makes as much or more than some Engineers and Scientists.

Knowing that why demonstrate?

I agree that the Lab is far better off to outsource these jobs.

I believe Akima has saved the Lab quite a bit, but i do not know that for sure.

Can the Lab get rid of the crafts workers and use Akima for this?

Let them sit at home and see how they feel about dissing the Lab.

Anonymous said...

January 22, 2014 at 11:11 AM

You might have a point if anyone on this thread actually said the things you impute to them. Just another dishonest tactic on your part. Every bit as bad as name calling, just more subtle.

Anonymous said...

So the craft workers do not make as much as an educated Engineer or Scientist?
What is dishonest about a fact?

Can a merit (non-union) crafts worker do as good or better than a lazy union worker?

No imputing here.

oh sorry break time. Gotta go for my union break.

Anonymous said...

oh sorry break time. Gotta go for my union break.

January 22, 2014 at 3:04 PM

Yeah, you deserve it after all that effort to create a post that completely obfuscates the point, and again imputes statements to previous posters that they did not make. Try to somehow be honest about your arguments.

Anonymous said...

I'm not a burger flipper. I belong to a union so I'm now a ground beef systems engineer that should be paid $20, no, $30, wait, $40, no, $50 per hour. I just want to be paid the market union rate of $50/hour to flip burgers. The market rate is what the union says the market rate is and I am outraged that I'm not getting that rate.

Anonymous said...

January 22, 2014 at 7:32 PM

The sad thing is, some out there will miss your point. Personally, I think you should be getting hazardous duty pay for working so close to deadly deep fat fryers. Plus an emotional hardship bonus for having to deal with the worst members of the public every minute of every day. Only scumbags and homeless people eat in fast food joints.

Anonymous said...

Poor union victims. boo hoo.
the Lab has treated the poor victims so bad:( poor infants....

Anonymous said...

You forgot to sign off your post with "POS."

Anonymous said...

No I think that applies more to a lazy union worker.
Poor victims.
Poor babies.

Anonymous said...

Why do some of you claim the the union folks are lazy?

Anonymous said...

I cannot speak to that but here is an example of unionism.

At the new 49er stadium (a union only construction job),
my neighbor works there and said the NFL heard some maybe drinking going on and did a on the spot drug/alcohol test on the union involved.

The test involved over 70 workers.
-34 passed
-6 failed
-30 refused to test and guess what, went back to the union hall to go on another job.

I think this speaks to these modern unions are not the great unions of old but political/corrupt organizations.
True story.

Anonymous said...

It will not be long until the Lab union will be giving money to the Democratic party for favors in return (like most unions).
Actually I heard that they are trying to do that.

Anonymous said...

January 23, 2014 at 9:36 PM

It doesn't take much "trying." All they have to do is write a check. If you think that's not already happening, you are very naive.

S said...


It appears that subservience to corporate desires is more common at the Labs than I would have expected.

I can only assume that that’s a result of being so unskilled that you feel lucky to have a job.

Although I guess it could be a result of being treated so well that you are just showing a high degree of appreciation for your masters.

Anonymous said...

It appears that subservience to corporate desires is more common at the Labs than I would have expected.

January 24, 2014 at 10:30 AM

You mean "willingness to do what the people who are paying your salary want you to do"? Geez, what a concept! You do understand that you are working for a corporation, right?

S said...

I'm not surprised that you don't understand that the corporate/labor relationship is symbiotic.

Or that that lack of understanding leaves you, and others, submissive to their demands and abuses.

Anonymous said...

You are so smart.......
Oh you forgot to mention only 6% of the symbiotic Corporate/Labor relationship want to be in a union.

Why is that?

I am with the 94% and would not be part of a union. there is a reason people do not want to be part of a union.
Try to figure it out.

Anonymous said...

Oh you forgot to mention only 6% of the symbiotic Corporate/Labor relationship want to be in a union.

January 24, 2014 at 6:35 PM

Your overall point is correct. However, it is a mistake to assume that the 6% of private sector workers who are members of a union WANT to be members of that union. Most of them don't, and resent union dues they pay being used to support political causes they don't agree with.

Anonymous said...

I wonder how many of you have ever worked with union members. I've worked along side both and the union guys are the more professional, more capable workers. As I understand it, unions have extensive training and independent checks for their membership, whereas non union guys are just guys that wandered into the job with a believable resume. They'll do what ever it takes to get a job done just as much as anyone else.

Anonymous said...

That is not true at all.
My neighbor who is a union carpenter all his life has guys doing cocaine on their way to union jobs.
Also everyone knows ex-felons can get union jobs.

That above post is the union line and not the reality at all.

Look try to think for yourself.

Anonymous said...

I enjoy the various comments made by fellow co-workers yes co-workers! about the ungrateful strikers at West Gate. You use terms uneducated, high school graduate, lacking in sophistication and stride, blue collar, this list goes on and on. I find it amusing that these so- called "minds of the universe" have such a dismay for those who light and heat our buildings, clean our buildings, weld and create a cohesive environment for all. Did it ever occur to any of you that your work environment and the atheistics of a commercial building go hand and hand? For whatever reason the Lab's thought process of
"differed" maintenance for all of the buildings has subsequently failed. Now those " blue collar, uneducated" people now have to undergo profit before performance as stressed by upper management which in the long run if the braintrust such as yourselves would know time is money and money is time and when your service department was cut to two or three people to once complete a task that was under budget, time and overall just yearly maintenance, it is pretty hard to continually hear when will this be done, the answer when we receive a work order and when the funding and the staff is available. How dare all of you to note such pathetic comments. The Lab is in a time warp as well as yourselves, trust me if given the proper funding for maintenance the Lab would once be known for its beauty and cutting edge technology. Remember that when you are in the restroom and everything is at your disposal, the buildings and appearance represent you as well.

Anonymous said...

January 25, 2014 at 4:01 PM

Your writing is pathetic. You are obviously uneducated and unable to proofread your own writing for spelling and grammar. By the way, most of the commenters here are NOT your "coworkers" but people who think unions have no place in today's workforce that should be based on merit, not seniority or connections. Try "deferred" not "differed" and who knows where you got "minds of the universe"! If you clean the restrooms, you are doing a much less satisfactory job than in the past. I don't notice fewer janitorial staff, just a lot less work being done, and a lot of janitorial staff taking over lunch rooms and conference rooms during the day for coffee and conversation. Sorry, just my observations.

Anonymous said...

Wow... once again the " time warp" mentality has spoken.. thank you for the corrected grammar and punctuation course... this is the vary thing I spoke of we are all co-workers regardless of your PHD to the fifth level. Your entitlement attitude is the reason why your and many others have such a hard time when it comes to change and progression in an everyday corporate level. Progression is a key to success and ALL of us would like to see forward movement at the Lab and rekindle the magic that once was at the Lab and not retain the mentality of who is smarter than who! Get on board with everyone else, we are all in this together, we all want a solid work environment as well a prosperity in defining cutting edge technology. That was the point of the strike.

Anonymous said...

Progression is a key to success...

January 26, 2014 at 9:09 AM

Well, I agree with that, but obviously you don't believe it, or you would have progressed further in school.

Anonymous said...

First time on the blog, was interested in the subject, but as I observe many of the comments made are more emotional than about the subject.

Anonymous said...

"Get on board with everyone else, we are all in this together,"

The WHOLE point is a non-union employee can do all of this work without the downside all unions have.

SO NO 94% of workers are not on board and want most people want nothing to do with a dirty union.

SO outsource these jobs to a non-union contractor and we do not have to see immature high schoolers jumping up and down at the West Gate.
PERIOD.

Anonymous said...

Unions are completely dead for the private workforce. The small (<6%) remainder will disappear with the fossils that control them. The public workforce is unfortunately still in jeopardy at around 20% but will soon fall as people realize that having union bosses decide who to elect and then sit down with those people after they're elected to negotiate contracts is the worst kind of corruption.

S said...

"will soon fall as people realize that having union bosses decide who to elect and then sit down with those people after they're elected to negotiate contracts is the worst kind of corruption."

Are they being told "who to elect"?

What do you see as "corrupt" about this process? :scratch

S said...

Based on the other concerns in this blog it appears that the union folks are the only people who understand that we have to work together if we expect a fair shake from the present Lab.

500 series
http://llnlthetruestory.blogspot.com/2014/01/500-series.html

Layoffs
http://llnlthetruestory.blogspot.com/2014/01/blog-post.html

cip?
http://llnlthetruestory.blogspot.com/2014/01/cip.html

Did management lie?
http://llnlthetruestory.blogspot.com/2014/01/did-management-lie.html


Anonymous said...

What do you see as "corrupt" about this process?

January 27, 2014 at 8:31 AM

Candidates with the most monetary support usually win. The public unions use dues money, involuntarily given by members, to support those candidates they wish to win (usually liberals) so they will have sympathetic (and beholden) officials to negotiate with over their contracts. That's not corrupt?

S said...

"Candidates with the most monetary support usually win. The public unions use dues money, involuntarily given by members, to support those candidates they wish to win (usually liberals) so they will have sympathetic (and beholden) officials to negotiate with over their contracts. That's not corrupt?"

That's an interesting POV when you consider the already stated point that unions only represent ~6% of our labor force.

I agree that the unions typically donate to (D) candidates but I see that as more about the (D)'s willingness to stand up and fight for the "common man" and the other party pushing their consistent trickle up policies.
And with that it stands to reason that they'd support those who support their members.

Are you under the impression that our elected representatives are negotiating with the Labs union?

Anonymous said...

That's an interesting POV when you consider the already stated point that unions only represent ~6% of our labor force.

Are you under the impression that our elected representatives are negotiating with the Labs union?

January 27, 2014 at 9:57 AM

Re-read the post. The point was about PUBLIC-SECTOR unions, which still represent over 25% of local, state, and federal government workers, and which indeed negotiate with elected officials. That's where the corruption is. Private-sector unions are indeed too tiny to have any effect on anything (except to make their members poor and their officers rich).

S said...

"Re-read the post. The point was about PUBLIC-SECTOR unions, which still represent over 25% of local, state, and federal government workers, and which indeed negotiate with elected officials. That's where the corruption is. Private-sector unions are indeed too tiny to have any effect on anything (except to make their members poor and their officers rich)."

So why all of the dislike for the Labs union if they have so little influence beyond their willingness to work together for the job security that so many lack here at the lab?

It's nice to see the 5% increase in "PUBLIC-SECTOR union" membership that happened between January 26, 2014 at 9:02 PM and January 27, 2014 at 11:14 AM

You folks are a hoot...

PS Thanks for ignoring the primary points of my earlier post and focusing on the minutia. lol

Anonymous said...

Thanks for ignoring the point of my earlier post that unions are corrupt and focusing on minutia like the actual percentage of public union membership.


You aren't a hoot, just intellectually dishonest. Hallmark of liberalism.

S said...

Feel free to point out where I've been "intellectually dishonest"?

I'm OK with your desire to believe that anyone who disagrees with your desire to diminish the standing of working people, and anyone who asks for your justification for that desire, must be a "liberal".

Actually, I wouldn't have it any other way because it does a great job of showing where your harmful and extremist beliefs reside.

And with that I'm happy to be well away from the ideas that you can't justify.

Anonymous said...

I never said anything about desiring to "diminish" anyone. In fact I don't so there's your intellectual dishonesty. If you think being anti-union is "harmful and extremist" you are either delusional, stuck in the 1930's, or simply slinging baseless accusations around in lieu of an actual argument. Again, intellectually dishonest (and again, a liberal trait).

S said...

With all of the "Anonymous said" stuff about unions being "lazy" and the desire to "outsource" their jobs and the claim that unions folks have a high rate of "drug use" (As if others don't)and all of the dislike that can't be justified beyond some 30-40 year old examples of financial abuse it's hard to know who said what so all of the "Anonymous said" stuff becomes one.
There's no "intellectual dishonesty" in that because so many of you are on the same page and who knows who said what when you hide behind anonymity.

Like I said I can handle your desire that I be seen as a "liberal" because I certainly reject the "CON"servative extremist beliefs of intolerance, religious extremism, political hypocrisy, corporate subservience, the endless desire for more trickle up economics and your harmful rejection of scientific findings (While seemingly working at a scientific entity)
Just to name a few.

So feel free to distinguish me as someone who doesn't believe the harmful things you folks stand for and I’ll make it a point to point out that folks like you put the “con” in conservative.

I can take it and I can give it.

Anonymous said...

I can take it and I can give it.

January 28, 2014 at 8:32 AM

Wow. Good for you. Sterling character description.

S said...

"Wow. Good for you. Sterling character description."

I agree.

Should I just roll over to the demands of monied interests like so many in here so willingly do?

Or should I fight for those like me and those behind me in their lives and careers?

You're all free to try to shout me down because you want a select few to dictate the direction of your lives.
I'm simply not willing to go along with your desire.

Anonymous said...

You're all free to try to shout me down because you want a select few to dictate the direction of your lives.
I'm simply not willing to go along with your desire.

January 28, 2014 at 10:00 AM

All the shouting seems to be coming from you. I seem to remember some shouting at the LLNL gates recently too. In life, people rarely get to decide what they will or won't "go along with," but good luck with that.

S said...

"All the shouting seems to be coming from you. I seem to remember some shouting at the LLNL gates recently too. In life, people rarely get to decide what they will or won't "go along with," but good luck with that."

I'm OK with your willingness to follow blindly as well as your “I know you are but what am I” form of discussion.

As a matter of fact I wouldn’t expect anything less.

Anonymous said...

I'm sorry you see no difference between "blindly following" and making the best out of situations you have no control over. Must make your life very frustrating, to have to deal with so many things you don't like.

S said...

“I'm sorry you see no difference between "blindly following" and making the best out of situations you have no control over. Must make your life very frustrating, to have to deal with so many things you don't like”.

I have control over almost every aspect of my life and so should you.
And with that I don’t have to deal with most of the things I don’t like.
I.e. “extremist beliefs of intolerance, religious extremism, political hypocrisy, corporate subservience, the endless desire for more trickle up economics and your harmful rejection of scientific findings”

So don’t go worrying about me and try to start worrying about the future generations that will be living with the corporate desire, that so many of you embrace, to diminish their futures because you're too weak to fight for what's right and fair.

I’m simply not willing to slam the doors of opportunity and fairness behind me like so many folks are so willing to encourage and all too willing to do.

Anonymous said...

Yeh, right, the blue collar people at LLNL are liberals and the educated professionals are the conservatives. In reality, whenever the blue collar people at LLNL express their opinions, they sound like 13-year-olds, neither liberal or conservative but instead immature, insensitive, ignorant, and apathetic.

Anonymous said...

Welcome to Kalifornia.

Reading the above posts makes me wonder how ungrateful people are for our large Corporations and our employment here at the Laboratory.

It is sad to see what is inside (belief system of Entitlement) of a hunk of flesh with a union mentality.

I find it hard to believe a person could possible be mored screwed up.

Anonymous said...

What I saw and heard at the West Gate looked like infants screaming for their Entitlements.
If I understand this now someone changing light bulbs (admitting that it is not easy in some areas) can make $60 an hour prevailing wage?

S said...

"Hey dude, I'm a Ph.D. physicist and I'm a conservative
I never worry about future generations. They will either get it right or they won't. Not my problem. It's all about personal responsibility, not obligation. Get over yourself."

I'm OK with all of your "screw everyone else because I've got mine" views.

I simply can't live like that because I went to public schools and the military played a part in honing my skills.
So I know that I didn't do it all myself and that most people can’t do it all themselves.

FWIW I consider myself a "conservative" too but I'm not a Cruz, Santorum, Huckabee, Paul, Perry. McConnell, Boehner conservative but more of a Reagan in his attentive day’s type conservative.

PS Every one of us here at these Labs knows a few Ph.D. who don't have a clue so don't pretend that your accomplishment puts you on some higher plane.

Anonymous said...

I'm OK with all of your "screw everyone else because I've got mine" views.

January 29, 2014 at 9:34 AM

There you go again.

Anonymous said...

About the above comment.

That was a good comeback...
I seriously laughed when it hit me:)

Anonymous said...

Judging from this blog, you guys at LLNL need to fix your hiring process even more than you need to fix NIF.

S said...

"Judging from this blog, you guys at LLNL need to fix your hiring process even more than you need to fix NIF."

Based on this blog (in its entirety) 62.7%* of the people here believe that they're lucky to have a job and they want others to feel the same way. And if you don’t feel that way they’ll throw out labels like ungrateful, crybabies, liberals, lazy, druggies, dirty, corrupt, uneducated, etc. with the hope of bringing others down to their level.

I'm fine with their beliefs and they are probably right about their "luck" but some of us actually bring very positive skills to these labs and those skills help the labs not only keep functioning but they save the labs money.

* 92.7% of all stats are pulled out of thin air. lol

Anonymous said...

I'm fine with their beliefs...

January 30, 2014 at 9:32 AM

You keep saying you're "fine" with things you've just spent a lot of time railing about. It's like saying "I hate your guts, but hey, who am I to judge?"

S said...

"You keep saying you're "fine" with things you've just spent a lot of time railing about. It's like saying "I hate your guts, but hey, who am I to judge?"

The idea that you think it takes "a lot of time" for me to type my responses tells me a whole lot about you. lol

Perhaps you ARE lucky to have a job.

Anonymous said...

Again another good comeback...seriously.
I get the joke even thought he jokee may not....
I am enjoying this.

Anonymous said...

The idea that you think it takes "a lot of time" for me to type my responses tells me a whole lot about you. lol

January 30, 2014 at 10:21 AM

There you go again.

Anonymous said...

Perhaps you ARE lucky to have a job.

January 30, 2014 at 10:21 AM

I don't. I'm very comfortably retired. If you do, you are really wasting a lot of your employer's time.

S said...

LOL
Great...the "does mom know what you are doing?" contingent has arrived.

That's some retirement you've got going on there.
I mean once I retire I certainly plan to spend lots of time discussing these labs.
OK maybe not...

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