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This BLOG is for LLNL present and past employees, friends of LLNL and anyone impacted by the privatization of the Lab to express their opinions and expose the waste, wrongdoing and any kind of injustice against employees and taxpayers by LLNS/DOE/NNSA. The opinions stated are personal opinions. Therefore, The BLOG author may or may not agree with them before making the decision to post them. Opinions not conforming to BLOG rules are deleted. Blog author serves as a moderator. For new topics or suggestions, email jlscoob5@gmail.com

Saturday, December 28, 2013

LLNL Wins Age Discrimination Lawsuit!!

LLNL Wins Age Discrimination Lawsuit!! Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory has won the age discrimination phase of a lawsuit alleging that 130 Laboratory employees were laid off improperly in 2008. In a verdict rendered last week in Alameda County Superior Court, a jury found that Laboratory managers had acted in good faith and followed their own policies and the law with regard to the ages of the laid off employees

26 comments:

Anonymous said...

One recent article on this topic:

The Independent 12/20/2013

Anonymous said...

Anyone have first hand insight as to some of the employees that were let go? Were they worthless, dated skill sets, or EBAs that couldn't find real work, etc., or was it something more than that?

Anonymous said...

I know a several who were let go, in their cases it was all politics. You have to get rid of people, so you get rid of the people who don't have powerful protectors. Their loss caused the fewest complaints in the room where they made those decisions. I'm sure age played some role just in terms of dollars, and the same game has been played this past year. Older people usually cost more, so you think of them first when you are looking to save money. But no one will ever put that in writing, or admit to those motivations on a witness stand.

Anonymous said...

We shouldn't use EIT or EBA status as a means to abuse employees. If the "worthless" or "dated" justification had merit, LLNS management in 2013 wouldn't have to resort to keeping new assignments secret, delaying assignments, molding assignments for their FTE buddies, or subjectively protecting Akima buddies from layoffs.

One need not be "worthless" or have "dated" skills to be placed on the EIT or EBA lists. You just need to be blacklisted by one or more LLNS managers. As a blacklisted EIT or EBA, your weekly submitted job inquiries can serve as a roadmap to ensure you stay blacklisted with prospective managers until your "reasonable period" to find an assignment runs out.

Anonymous said...

Yes, it is a blacklist. Even in the olden days when money flowed like water, it was a blacklist, but at least it was usually a short exile. Now that all the money is gone, it means you are on the way out the gate.

Anonymous said...

The layoff process was not perfect. There were some Division Leaders who didn't have the slightest idea what their people did. Because the process was kept at a very high level, group leaders and programmatic managers of matrixed individuals may not have had an opportunity to weigh in. On the other hand, many people that I knew on the list clearly deserved to be there and should have been let go years agol

Anonymous said...

Let's face it. It was the worker bees that absorbed the majority of the layoffs. So as far as “fairness” goes, the scales of justice were already tipped, regardless of age. Middle and ULM saw very little loss. What we have now is a bloated management ready to burst. Images of Mr. Creosote in The Meaning of Life come to mind…
Problem is, us expendables are still expected to continue meeting all deliverables and milestones on time and with no schedule changes. Fewer workers - same work load – no pay increases. They tell us to work safe and deliberate, but you’d better not miss a deadline. On top of that, they took away Stores, Motor Pool, and many shop services that were vital support. These people do not care about LLNL or what is best for this nation’s security. Sometimes saving a few dollars is NOT the best course of action! But you can’t tell them that. They are smarter than you. IMO, this type of person lives in Potterville, counting their money and spinning their webs.

Anonymous said...

How many managers do you all think LLNL has? And what do you think the ratio is between "managers" (defined in some way) and "non-managers". LANL responses not allowed---it is obvious they are top heavy under any definition of manager. But at LLNL I think (if the definition is salary classification) that the number has gone down and the ratio has decreased.

Anonymous said...

In the Science & Technology area, I believe that we now have specific job classifications for everybody. Some of them are defined as "technical management". It should be possible to get a breakdown of how many people are in each job class, and from that determine the number of managers. I must admit that I don't know how to do this, but it seems like it should be knowable.

Anonymous said...

Since (I assume that) most of the people that were laid off were at the bottom of the food chain at LLNL, someone should check and see if their managers were reassigned by the managers managers to be new worker bees again. I bet not. LLNL is top and middle heavy.

Brent Knapp, new acting Director, should get HR to develop a very precise definition for "manager" and ask all ADs at LLNL to show him each of their manager to worker ratios. If its not somewhere between 1:10 to 1:15 they should be made to conform to this industry standard.

Anonymous said...

"...If its not somewhere between 1:10 to 1:15 they should be made to conform to this industry standard..."

If the programs don't complain about the overhead costs to support these managers, nothing will change.
Since many LLNS programs don't have direct private sector competition, the business viability feedback loop is not present.

In NIF a LLNS FTE 300 series manager took the job of a laid off Akima 500 series warehouse employee last Fall 2012. Did the NIF manager transform into a "worker bee"? Yah right. You see the 300 series manager brought 300 series "scope" and "insight" to the departing Akima 500 series assignment. Try that one if your just a technical 300 series looking for work. What a monopoly. For you my accomplished technical 300 series friend, well, a reclassification downward is in your future. Hold your head up and be happy about it.

Managers generally don't face lay offs unless they do something so offensive the lab can't defend it, hide it, or lost control of the information. Even in those rare cases, all actions are spun as voluntary.

Anonymous said...

The self proclaimed professionals highly educated self absorbed, pity not one ounce of common sense. The rest of the world can see for what the lab truly represents. Self loathing waste of money,energy, time and space. I only wish a criminal investigation would take place and put people behind bars for the 50+ years of failure and true waste.


POS

Anonymous said...

Any place that forces people to come to work during the day of the layoff, then uses assault weapons to walk them out, is not a place anyone should want to work. Who those people were, or how well they worked, is not the question you should be debating.

Anonymous said...

Don't expect LLNS to provide a dignified escort out the gate. They are ruthless. The environment at the LLNS managed LLNL, no longer resembles the UC managed LLNL. I can not see a category were LLNS brings value added, other than to LLNS itself $$$.

Anonymous said...

Happy New Years everyone. I hope 2014 brings peace to "POS" soul. It has been sad seeing his/her pathetic posts all year. We love you POS.

Anonymous said...

Is POS still posting? I thought maybe his IP was possibly blocked.

Anonymous said...

The attorneys asked the wrong questions or didn't depose the right individuals involve at the time. As someone who was in the middle of the process at the time I can tell you for a fact many of the targeted employees were not liked by the senior managers who selected them for RIF. it was arbitrary and personal. Look what Moffet, Smith and Leary did to the folks in the business directorate. Look who is still around in that organization. More importantly, how many 100 series managers were let go? The answer is zero. I think the lawyers blew it. Didn't know who to ask and where to look. I am glad I got out five years ago.

Anonymous said...

"Knocking off" older employees is a game that the NNSA lab managers have perfected over the years. The lawyers at the labs are experts at advising how to do it without the risk of any nasty blow-back from legal repercussions.

Unlike sex or race discrimination, few cases are ever won against age discrimination in America. It seems to be a type of discrimination that is largely accepted by the public.

Anonymous said...

Any place that forces people to come to work during the day of the layoff, then uses assault weapons to walk them out, is not a place anyone should want to work.

December 31, 2013 at 2:12 AM

Exactly how did the guards "use assault weapons"?? You mean they carried them in the course of their duties, which they always do. Try to tamp the hyperbole a little.

Anonymous said...

"Moffet, Smith" Business Strategy
(per Trial testimony) :

Kept a FX (with 2years seniority) and ISP/IN (30+ years seniority), since keeping a FX would allow us the flexibility and ease to reduce staff in the future! ...... (With this strategy, Mgr can layoff any IN they dislike.
Why didn't George put this business strategy bullet on his view graphs during his ISP presentation?)

Anonymous said...

So many of the llnl managers (really the low and mid-level) spend the most if their time intentionally creating distress or problems so that they can get credit for fixing it. This is particularly true for managers who are not technically sharp and went into management because that was the only remaining path for their personal advancement. Getting credit for fixing problems that you intentionally created is called "Munchausen-at-work." The next time you see your busy body manager running around, managing upwards as usual, and getting the ear of so-and-so, all amidst a crisis, look to see if you manager's apparent poor decisionmaking also created or helped amplify the problem. I could name five managers at LLNL who regularly do this, though to be honest it was hard to detect initially.

Anonymous said...

Typically, these are the mangers appointed to a project (they need funded projects to cover their salary).

Anonymous said...

Why many of them will never be EBA. Have programs fund their existence. Not really added value. Not really needed.

Anonymous said...

How many EE and ME managers became "worker bees" or EBAs when EE and ME merged? LLNS Managers get first pick of every assignment or create them out of thin air. What ever it takes to remain in the royal family. Any attractive left overs go to their buddies. Any remaining scraps left over too long might get formally posted for the commoners.

Anonymous said...


Exactly.

Anonymous said...

It's not age discrimination anymore. It's disability discrimination. Yes, some of us can't make it to work 8am-5pm, due to medications, or physical disability. Yes, we can work remotely from home on a shifted schedule. So instead of accommodating people they are shoving them through medical to get job restrictions which bosses promptly don't accommodate. Current employees, I encourage you to conform to this strict schedule, and don't get sick for 5 days. Also, get an outside doctor you can trust don't let lab doctors communicate with your doctor. Get something in writing from your doctor. Your supervisor is in charge of accommodation, not lab medical.

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